Roll for Sandwich is a popular video series on TikTok where creator Jacob Pauwels uses dice to determine the ingredients of his sandwiches, with the series growing a ton since its inception. Not to mention, Roll for Sandwich has since inspired numerous spinoffs throughout TIkTok where content creators roll for everything from pizza to ice cream and sushi, and the series has also attracted plenty of newcomers to the world of tabletop games.
Pauwels spoke to Game ZXC about the unexpected success of his TikTok series, his future plans, setting trends, and also offered some insight on D&D and roleplaying games. The following interview has been edited for clarity and brevity.
Q: Roll for Sandwich seemed to blow up overnight. What has it been like seeing that success on your end?
A: I didn't expect anything to come to this, so it's been pretty crazy. I'm close to 1.7 million followers now on TikTok, and I started in April of last year, so it hasn't even been a full year yet.
Q: What was the most difficult part of starting the series and maintaining it?
A: Starting the series was fairly easy because like I said, I didn't really expect it to become anything, but maintaining it has been a challenge. When I first started, I was doing it five days a week, and now I'm posting three days a week. A big part of that is just how different my life looks now than it did when we started. When we started, I had a two-and-a-half-year-old, and now I have almost a three-and-a-half-year-old. I stay home with her during the day, and the amount of attention that she requires during the day has changed. We don't have any other kind of daycare, we've tried some things that haven't worked out, and so I'm pretty much doing this whenever I can, whenever the house is quiet. So that's probably been the biggest challenge to keep it going and make the right balance. My wife is about to have another baby, and I'm just making sure that I can do this and enjoy it but still have time for my family. So that's been the biggest challenge, but so far, we've been able to balance it pretty well.
Q: So you've worked with a lot of food brands since launching the series. What's that been like?
A: Pretty good. I've actually done a lot more work with non-food brands, which has been cool that they are interested in my content and want to support it and see it as a viable vehicle to reach my audience. I've done a couple of food-related ones too, and those are always interesting. I get a mix of responses because, you know, it's the internet. So you get a wide range of responses from good to not-so-good. But I'm learning how to incorporate stuff into my content without trying to change it too much. It's been going pretty well.
Q: How do you approach your various charts? Are there some things that seem to work better than others, like ketchup always being on one?
A: I mean, that's always on one, just because it's my personal least favorite condiment. So that one's pretty much been on there since the beginning and will stay on there. But everything else, I've just tried to keep it fresh, keep it fun. I'm a very exploratory eater, I like to try new things, I'll pretty much try anything once, and I try to give everything a fair shake. So I put things on there that people suggest or that I discover, or I'll go to an international market or something like that and find things I've never had before. I don't always end up liking them, but I always try to give them a fair shot, and sometimes I get surprised by things I never expected.
Q: Your idea has inspired a number of other content creators who roll die for various things, like Roll for Pizza. How do you feel about this TikTok 'meta' that's been erupting?
A: It's interesting. You know, feelings are complicated. I definitely think it's really cool to have inspired a lot of people. I like when people make it their own, when they try to put their own spin on it, rather than just taking my formula and kind of reproducing it 100%. But I've seen some really cool things come out of it, things that I wouldn't be able to do myself, and it's cool to see other people do them. One of my favorite series that I have inspired is Roll for Sushi. That guy really knows his stuff when it comes to that. I wouldn't be able to make an informative show that handled the subject matter well, whereas he has the experience and is a part of that culture. So it's cool to watch his take on it. I really enjoy that and a lot of the other ones that have popped up.
Q: The name Adventures in Aardia comes from a fantasy novel you've been working on. Has Roll for Sandwich always been the plan for the channel, or has it just kind of taken over in popularity?
A: I didn't have a "super" plan for the channel. I started the channel when I started DMing, and I was DMing a story in the world of my novel. I originally started sharing just little things from my foray into DMing whether it was props that I had created for my characters or videos of some terrain that I made out of Legos for some of our encounters. Like I said, I stay home with my daughter. So I had the idea for Roll for Sandwich as something that would be easy to film while she was home. And so I did that, and then that first video from the very first one just blew up in a way that I wasn't expecting. So that has become a majority of what I spend my time on with my channel. Were I able to do this full time, I'd probably incorporate some other stuff more frequently, but right now, I'm kind of at capacity, but I really enjoy what I'm doing. I try to take breaks when I can and not get burned out. I didn't really have a plan per se, but once it took off, I feel like I used a lot of experience that I have to make it something.
Q: What can you tell us about your novel? How's it coming?
A: I've been working on it for over three years now. Obviously, that coincides pretty closely with when my daughter was born. So I started it maybe nine months or so before she was born, maybe a little bit ahead of that. Then, she was born, and then we had the COVID-19 lockdown. There's been a lot of things that have just made it not progress as fast as I would like, but I've been able to consistently get back to it and work on it. It's definitely the longest piece of fiction I've written at this point. It's the most developed. It's just not quite ready to have other eyes on it yet, but I'm trying whenever I can to get back to it and keep it going. That would be a dream come true for me to release a book, and hopefully, several books that I've worked on. And I'm about to have another baby. That doesn't throw too big of a wrench in things though, my wife is very supportive and helps me find the time to work on it.
Q: You take part in NaNoWriMo and have taken a break from the series to work on your novel. Do you think NaNoWriMo is a good way for newer writers to focus on their novels?
A: Definitely! I think it's cool. It helps to know that other people are doing the same thing that you're doing at the same time, the same struggle that you're doing. So you can kind of commiserate and relate to other people that are in the same thing as you and get advice from other people. And they have a lot of great resources throughout that month, and also throughout the year to help you develop your writing and stuff. So it's great, but also that kind of deadline or pressure is not for everyone, and I think that it's completely valid to not do something like that.
Q: There's been controversy in the D&D community about OGL changes and other things. As a content creator, how do you feel about this?
A: I didn't really address it on my channel, just because a vast majority of the people on my channel are not D&D people. I mean, I barely understand it, so I chose not to address it on my channel, but there are a lot of moving pieces. I definitely think that the original plan was not a great one and that the changes that have come out since people raised their voices and canceled their D&D Beyond subscriptions are definitely better. I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know how much better it is. It's not readily apparent to me. It's hard because there are a lot of different people in play here. I have no ill will against the employees at Wizards or the people who work hard on the modules and everything. There are so many people that I still like and respect and don't want to have this negatively affect them.
But it boils down to how very large companies and corporations own a lot of these IPs, and a company exists to make money. Unless you are a nonprofit, that's what they exist to do. And so a lot of times, that's how the decisions are made. Hopefully, they're not made in such a way as to alienate and destroy their entire fan base. I don't agree with it, but I understand why it happened.
Hopefully, they take what happened in response as a sign that that was a mistake, and that they should really think about what their community likes about their product and about D&D as a whole.
Q: What are your plans for Roll for Sandwich in 2023?
A: My plans are to keep putting out episodes. I'm in Roll For for Sandwich Season Three right now, which is going to end abruptly when my new baby is born. We don't know exactly when that's going to happen yet, so I'm going to work pretty much right up until that happens and then take a little bit of parental leave, then come back and start up again. I've got some stuff set up for the summer; I'm going to be at NocoCon in New York in June. So definitely planning to keep going and hopefully find some time. My wife's a teacher, so she has summers off. I'm hoping that during the summer, I might get some extra time to work more on my novel. So that, and having a kid, and keeping on rolling for sandwiches. I'm talking to some different people about collaborations and stuff, so there'll be some fun things on the horizon that I can't really talk about yet.
Q: With the success of Roll for Sandwich, are you planning on moving into other types of content creation like podcasts or streaming?
A: Maybe. I have everything I need to make a podcast other than a concept that I really believe in. There are a lot of podcasts out there, and nobody needs me just ranting for no reason. If I come up with a good concept that I think would be fun and not just add to all the noise, then potentially, but I don't have plans to start one right now. As far as other media goes, when I started the channel I was doing some live Roll for Sandwiches. I'd love to get back to that. Our life is just so crazy right now that there's not often a time when I can monopolize the kitchen for several hours, and have it be quiet and have the availability to do that out of my house right now.
It's not quite the type of thing that pays enough for me to like rent an office space with a kitchen or something. If we got to that someday, that'd be amazing and maybe make it easier to make content, but at the moment, everything's out of my house. So yeah, I don't have any plans. I'd like to get back to doing some live events I did. I was at a con this past weekend where I did a live "Roll For" type event that was more or less a game show where people could come roll for dessert for the teens at the con. And that that went really well, that was really fun. So I'd love to do some more stuff like that and try to figure out how to do maybe some meetup-type things in various places.
Q: Have you discovered any interesting ingredient combinations that have become part of your day-to-day cooking?
A: So people ask me, "has there ever been a sandwich that you made on the show that you then eat on the regular now" and I mean, maybe there would be if I wasn't making so many sandwiches for the show. I do eat sandwiches when I'm not filming, but I'm using up ingredients that I'm buying for the show that I need to use before they go bad. So I'm not often setting out to make a specific sandwich over and over again. There are definitely ones that I have discovered, like, sandwich number 42 I point back to a lot as it was just a combination that was so unexpected, and I liked it so much that I made it immediately the next day because I still had all the ingredients for it.
After that video, I sent it out to the rest of sandwich Tiktok and was like, "Hey, you got to make this sandwich and let me know if it's good" It was white bread, peanut butter, goat cheese, avocado, lettuce, mild peppers, and kimchi mayo. It was really good. It was weird, but it was really good. The kimchi mayo and the lettuce and the peanut butter combined to make a Thai flavor. Like Thai lettuce wraps always have a peanut sauce with some spice. So you got that stuff together, and then you just added on this tangy sauce from the goat cheese and fat from the avocado, which just ended up being really good. So that one surprised me. I've learned that cinnamon raisin bread can be good for a lot more sandwiches than you would think. Just that little bit of sweetness to offset the salty meat or whatever you end up with. I think if I've learned anything from this, it's that it helps to have an open mind.
Q: A lot of people watching your videos consider giving D&D a shot after seeing how fun it can be dealing with these unpredictable outcomes. Is there any advice you'd give to someone going into their first game?
A: I would say don't stress about it and try to have fun. It's a game. It can be intimidating, especially if you're playing in person or playing with people you don't know very well. No one expects you to have all the rules memorized. I DM and I don't know all the rules, I have to look stuff up. That's not the point. You know, we're not machines, We're just people getting together to have fun. I think if you let yourself relax and not have too much pressure, It'll be fun.
If you want to try to do a character voice, go ahead and try. But it's intimidating, it's hard to do that kind of stuff in front of people, especially people you don't know. Just try to have fun with it. The more you do it, the better you'll get at it and the more comfortable you'll be, and then maybe you can try stuff that you know you think would be fun. Sometimes it just takes getting into a place that you're comfortable with first. I definitely think that it's worth a shot. It's some of the most fun I've ever had. I've always been a storyteller. I've always been interested in stories. It's fun to write a story with other people and a little bit of chaos.
Q: What are some of your favorite tabletop games? What draws you to those?
A: Man, I think I have a favorite for every situation. I really enjoy Star Wars Imperial Assault. It's a miniature combat game in the Star Wars universe and has an app associated with it that can play the enemy for you. You barely need a DM. You, or you and some friends, can sit down and play through a campaign with the computer controlling the enemies, which is fun. For a little bit larger groups, Mysterium is a really fun game. One person plays a ghost that can only communicate by showing you abstract pictures. It's kind of like Clue, you use those abstract pictures to figure out which suspect committed the murder of this ghost player. So one person plays the ghost and the other players play trying to guess the clues that the ghost is giving. And that one's really fun.
My wife and I love Wingspan. That's an engine builder game that is themed around birdwatching. We probably played that game like 300 times or more, we literally played it every day, last December, every day of the month, sometimes multiple times a day. It's harder now with the age that our child is at to play games as often. So we ended up going into that one a lot more often because we can basically play it in our sleep, we don't have to think too hard. If we're tired, we can just pull out Wingspan and play it and have a good time without having to be too exhausted. So those are some of my favorites.
Q: Do you have a specific review scale for your sandwiches?
A: It's kind of subjective. Food in general is subjective. I tried to evaluate flavor, texture, and how the sandwich holds together. And then, you know, interest. If I have a super plain sandwich that tastes really great, and I have a weird combination that tastes really great, I'm probably going to rate the weird combination higher than the plain sandwich just because it was so unexpected and has such interesting ingredients. There are some people who would rate each individual metric and then come up with an average and add them together. I largely go with my gut. I taste it, I try to think about all those things, and then give a number that seems to represent how it makes me feel.
Q: Is there anything else you would like to shout out or mention?
A: I mentioned NocoCon, that's coming up at the beginning of June this year. I'd like to tell everyone that follows me that I appreciate them and that I'll be back after the baby's born. Don't worry, I'm going to take some time to make sure everything's okay and that my wife is recovering well, and then I'll be back making videos.
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